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How to set up ILS

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alastairg100
Guest





Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:23 pm 

I understand how to fly an ILS into an airport, however I do not now how to set it up, as in the flying lessons it is all pre-set and you just have to fly in. This made the Schipol - Heathrow / Rotterdam mission quite difficult as there was very little visiblity so I was just flying on GPS into Rotterdam. Would it be possible if anyone could explain for an idiot to understand how to set up and appy the ILS on FSX.

Thanks
Alastair
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x pilot
Guest





Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:44 pm 

hi there

i will try help you my best, hopefully with your understanding of the ILS you will grasp with what i tell you! first you need to find the approach plate for the intended runway you want to land at or get told to land at, this is easy as say for example atc say to you> you are 67miles bla bla landing runway 09...

ok bring up the gps, selec proc, select approach, scroll down to the runway that you are going in to, select vectors to final then enter... then scroll through the gps pages and find the nav frequencey for the ILS for that runway, eg. it will say runway 09 119.10



put that frequncy into NAv 1 and make sure its your active frequency, make sure your nav/gps switch is set to nav...

the atc should vector you in far enough to intercept the localizer, ahh make sure you course heading bug is set to 090 for the runway...

go to the gps again then click prc then activate approach, then enter then you can zoom in and use this as a REFERANCE that you on the right track...

you should see the localizer needle move when you intercept it, so keep the needle in the middle and wait to intercept the glidescope, you should be at the approach altitude now, once you hit the GS then you a good to land provided you keep everything in the middle, remember the needles are ver sensitive on the ILS so only small movements, make sure speeds and flap setting etc... and make sure you got 3 greens...

i hope this helps, it is quite hard to explain a complex system in a format like this!

cheers
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Gugge
Guest





Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 2:39 pm 

Thanks a lot, x pilot.
This really helped me out.
I tried it from a flight from Landvetter/Sweden - Heathrow/UK and it worked out perfect...

Thanks once again.
/Gugge!
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x pilot
Guest





Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 5:32 pm 

no worries mate...

glad it made sence and worked out, i did a flight from manchester to heathrow in a 74 this a.m and i real world weather on, vis was low so i was vectored to 09LR at heathrow and did a automatic landing, saved the approach to vid so i have it saved so when i figure out how to put it on this site i will, it was on fs9 tho maxed out... its quite good, perfect set up so i glad all is well in the IFR world of flight sim,

if you need any other help on flying let me know
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Guest






Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 6:53 pm 

x pilot wrote:


and make sure you got 3 greens...

cheers


I've read your very helpful post. Thanks. One question though, what do you mean when you say "make sure you got 3 greens?
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mspot72
Trainee
Trainee

Pro Member

Joined: Feb 04, 2007
Posts: 3
Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 7:12 pm 

very helpful post

thanks alot

3 green i presume he meains your gear is down, cos in a normal flight your landing checklist would include "gear down 3 green"
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x pilot
Guest





Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 7:20 pm 

as with the above post 3 green is GEAR DOWN AND LOCKED...

radio proceedure in real life when on final in IFR would be to confirm to ATC that you have £ green, see the gear lights on the panel, when down you have 3 green and when up 3 red...

glad the info was a help
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garylauderdale
Guest





Posted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 7:56 pm 

goto

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=ILS+tutorial

for an explanatory video on youtube
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lackoftalent
Trainee
Trainee

Pro Member

Joined: Jan 10, 2007
Posts: 5
Posted: Thu Feb 15, 2007 3:45 pm 

Still trying to do an ILS landing. I will check out the video and see if it helps. ANy other tips
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CRJCapt
Chief Captain
Chief Captain

Pro Member

Joined: Sep 12, 2005
Posts: 4275
Location: Ohio,USA
Posted: Thu Feb 15, 2007 5:01 pm 

The Instrument Landing System
Arrow http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/ils.htm
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lackoftalent
Trainee
Trainee

Pro Member

Joined: Jan 10, 2007
Posts: 5
Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:35 pm 

Can someone show me what the instrument panel is supposed ( a picture) to look like on a CRJ-700 just so I can't make sure I have the right set up. The glide path for the ILS.
Also I could only get the frequency on Nav2 but I did hear the beeps.
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Asuke
Guest





Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2007 6:39 pm 

x pilot wrote:
hi there

i will try help you my best, hopefully with your understanding of the ILS you will grasp with what i tell you! first you need to find the approach plate for the intended runway you want to land at or get told to land at, this is easy as say for example atc say to you> you are 67miles bla bla landing runway 09...

ok bring up the gps, selec proc, select approach, scroll down to the runway that you are going in to, select vectors to final then enter... then scroll through the gps pages and find the nav frequencey for the ILS for that runway, eg. it will say runway 09 119.10



put that frequncy into NAv 1 and make sure its your active frequency, make sure your nav/gps switch is set to nav...

the atc should vector you in far enough to intercept the localizer, ahh make sure you course heading bug is set to 090 for the runway...

go to the gps again then click prc then activate approach, then enter then you can zoom in and use this as a REFERANCE that you on the right track...

you should see the localizer needle move when you intercept it, so keep the needle in the middle and wait to intercept the glidescope, you should be at the approach altitude now, once you hit the GS then you a good to land provided you keep everything in the middle, remember the needles are ver sensitive on the ILS so only small movements, make sure speeds and flap setting etc... and make sure you got 3 greens...

i hope this helps, it is quite hard to explain a complex system in a format like this!

cheers



You rock :] Thanks I needed that. Works for FS2004 too!
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Guest






Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 12:58 am 

I have been trying without success to complete this mission Schipol - Rotterdam - Heathrow on the Boeing 737. The problem arrises when I try to intercept the localizer at Rotterdam. The center line and glide slope doesn't seem to move. I have set the radio's to the correct frequency and approach course. I can successfully land using ILS at every other airport I have tried except for Rotterdam.

Has anyboy tried this mission and come accross this problem?
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x pilot
Guest





Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 6:41 pm 

if its the mission where there is a dude that gets a heart attack and you have to divert then if everything is set for the correct runway and approach it works! double check, check again, ensure you select NAV not GPS!

cheers
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New Guest
Guest





Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 1:48 pm 

Ok, I too know how to setup an ILS approach but here's my problem:

What about the autopilot and radio? How should it be setup so that it works with ILS? Should the radio NAV be ON all the time? How do I use the heading? Should it be turned on to NAV, NAV and HDG, or HDG?

I've been using FSX for about 2 months now and I've gotten real comfortable with using visual approaches and landings on the jets. Problem is sometimes there is clouds and fog that prevent me from doing this.

Please help. If this has alraedy been discussed, please reply the link to that thread. Thanks X Pilot for that great ILS detail.
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bobbyz
Guest





Posted: Fri Mar 23, 2007 1:04 am 

Iíve only been a convert to FS since FSX came out and Iíve found out virtually everything I need to know from this great forum, so this is what I do; someone can tell me Iím wrong if need be. Also, I apologise if this doesnít answer your question or if I am telling you something you already know.

Once youíve been given the runway by ATC they should set you on a specific heading, so you should set your autopilot to HDG (this should I think disengage the NAV on the AP)

I assume you have set up the ILS frequency in the radio NAV and set the nav/gps switch to nav. When you do this, you do not need to turn the radio NAV ON; the only reason for doing this is that it will give you the morse code sounds to let you know when you are close enough to the runway to pick up that frequency. I do tend turn it on and then once the morse code starts I turn it off; you will remain tuned to it even with the radio NAV set to OFF.

ATC will continue to give you heading and altitudes to follow and then eventually they will give you final approach and instruct you to contact the Tower. At this point, I hit the APR (approach) button on the AP. The HDG and ALT buttons will remain lit on the AP at this point and the plane will continue to follow the set HDG and ALT.

The heading given to you by ATC will ensure that you intercept the localiser. The moment you intercept, the HDG light on the AP should go out (APR and ALT should remain lit), and the plane should begin to turn and line up with the runway.

As you approach the runway the plane will then intercept the glide slope; at this point the ALT light on the AP should now go out (now only APR remains lit) and the plane will follow the glide slope down. You obviously need to control flaps, speed, etc at this point.

Donít know if this helps
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Guest






Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 10:35 am 

Great reply, this really helped! OK, I know how to set it up, I learned to use it, now I need one more step.

I'm not all that familiar with the outter and inner markers. What are they for? How long do I keep ILS on my autopilot? I noticed that I make some very hard landings. Am I suppost to disengage autopilot at some point?

THanks in advance!
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CRJCapt
Chief Captain
Chief Captain

Pro Member

Joined: Sep 12, 2005
Posts: 4275
Location: Ohio,USA
Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 11:13 am 

Anonymous wrote:
Great reply, this really helped! OK, I know how to set it up, I learned to use it, now I need one more step.

I'm not all that familiar with the outter and inner markers. What are they for? How long do I keep ILS on my autopilot? I noticed that I make some very hard landings. Am I suppost to disengage autopilot at some point?

Marker beacons are simply radio transmitters that positively identify your location on the approach by giving you a flashing light and a Morse code audio tone as you fly over them. More important when using the Localizer only approach than a full ILS approach. Marker beacons are somewhat out dated and are being removed from many real world locations. They are being replaced by DME(Distance Measuring Equipment) and GPS.

The Autopilot(AP) is normally turned off no lower than 200 feet above ground level(AGL). The ILS, and AP, are not designed to and won't land the aircraft. Most aircraft are not designed to land on AP. The exception is Autoland. You would have to download the feature, download a panel with the feature or buy or download an aircraft with the feature. Flight simulator default aircraft don't have autoland. The purpose of the ILS is to get the aircraft to a point from which the pilot can see the runway environment and land visually. Normally this point is no lower than 200 ft. AGL at a distance of 1/2 statue miles.
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bobbyz
Guest





Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 12:16 pm 

Anonymous wrote:
I noticed that I make some very hard landings.



Remember that you need to have slowed the plane right down when landing; use lots of flap and ease right back on the power as you descend down the glideslope; I aim for a speed of around 140 to 160 knts at touchdown
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Guest






Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 1:39 pm 

CRJCapt wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Great reply, this really helped! OK, I know how to set it up, I learned to use it, now I need one more step.

I'm not all that familiar with the outter and inner markers. What are they for? How long do I keep ILS on my autopilot? I noticed that I make some very hard landings. Am I suppost to disengage autopilot at some point?

Marker beacons are simply radio transmitters that positively identify your location on the approach by giving you a flashing light and a Morse code audio tone as you fly over them. More important when using the Localizer only approach than a full ILS approach. Marker beacons are somewhat out dated and are being removed from many real world locations. They are being replaced by DME(Distance Measuring Equipment) and GPS.

The Autopilot(AP) is normally turned off no lower than 200 feet above ground level(AGL). The ILS, and AP, are not designed to and won't land the aircraft. Most aircraft are not designed to land on AP. The exception is Autoland. You would have to download the feature, download a panel with the feature or buy or download an aircraft with the feature. Flight simulator default aircraft don't have autoland. The purpose of the ILS is to get the aircraft to a point from which the pilot can see the runway environment and land visually. Normally this point is no lower than 200 ft. AGL at a distance of 1/2 statue miles.


Oh ok! I fly the 747 more than the others, so I'm pretty comfortable with it. Yea I try to land between 150-160 kts at 25 flaps at a descent no more than -500ft/min. I'll disengage at 200ft and try that.

Oh yea, should I be setting the autobrakes? I always land without them and use only wing and Rthrust. I've done very good, landing without over-running.

I've gotten very good and visual and instrumentation approaches, and trying to learn the "easy way" with the ILS and GPS.

Thanks everyone for all your help!
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CRJCapt
Chief Captain
Chief Captain

Pro Member

Joined: Sep 12, 2005
Posts: 4275
Location: Ohio,USA
Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 3:03 pm 

Autobrake use is up to you, it's not needed. In the real world, airlines require the use of autobrake under certain slippery runway conditions and/or short runways. The system can also automate brake application during a rejected takeoff. The autobrake system is less likely to damage tires than a human pilot. Most of the time, pilots use manual brakes. Either way is good, your preference.

PS Guest posters, please choose a name or even a number. It can be hard to keep straight who you're communicating with if we have multiple "Guest".
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xsailor
Guest





Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 3:01 am 

I have a question. X - pilor has explained great. I landed just like he wrote once! Other times i failed. One time, which happened a few times before, when I hit APPR, the plane went into turns and flips, went up to 4000 ft all of a sudden, sped up and did a useless 360 degree turn. Why would that happen? What is the "course heading bug set at 090"???? is that why?


I put NAV1 as ILS frequency, and localizer started moving and I hit APPR. What else? what did I forgot? thanks!
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CRJCapt
Chief Captain
Chief Captain

Pro Member

Joined: Sep 12, 2005
Posts: 4275
Location: Ohio,USA
Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2007 4:53 pm 

xsailor wrote:
I have a question. X - pilor has explained great. I landed just like he wrote once! Other times i failed. One time, which happened a few times before, when I hit APPR, the plane went into turns and flips, went up to 4000 ft all of a sudden, sped up and did a useless 360 degree turn. Why would that happen? What is the "course heading bug set at 090"???? is that why? I put NAV1 as ILS frequency, and localizer started moving and I hit APPR. What else? what did I forgot? thanks!

There is much more to flying the ILS than just setting the frequency and hitting a button. The aircraft must be at the corrcect position relative to the ILS course, the correct altitude and the correct heading with the radios set correctly. If these things are not accomplished, it won't work.
Arrow http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/ils.htm
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x pilot
Guest





Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2007 10:18 pm 

Hi,

Ok, flying VFR is easy after a while! The invetion of the ILS was to be able to land with not being able to see the runway so dont get angry with the clouds!

a way of doing this get your plane, get a quiet airport, check out the charts and runways, frequencys etc etc, make print out of these! keep them to hand, ok take off do a circuit of the airport, while on the downwind place a card over the top half of your screenso you cant see the ground and learn to fly with instruments ( not easy )

have the ILS frequncy sey in NAV 1, course needle set to the runway heading, press the loud speaker audio switch for NAV 1 on, when you start picking up signal for it you will hear this in morse code, every VOR, NDB etc is identified by a morse code...

make sure NAV/GPS switch is set to nav, have the GPS up with the app set into on with it active! this will be a guide, have you FD ON, what plane you flying? different system for each plane! ie the instrument on the panel might work in conjunction or be seperate instruments!

have a look on the FS04 forums i have posted some sights on there to explain ILS etc...


all while this is going on in flight sim you need to slow down, keep the needles/balls in the middle, flaps, gear pre landing checks etc to have arealsitic landing, in reallife there is a first officer, so it makes the cockpit busy, demading and hard when learning, do expect the first flight to break the clouds and have the runway there for you all ligned up and on the glides scope!

cheers
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jellrod
First Officer
First Officer

Pro Member

Joined: Mar 15, 2007
Posts: 260
Location: Seattle
Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 7:51 pm 

OMG - your comment:

"place a card over the top half of your screen so you cant see the ground and learn to fly with instruments "

That brought back so many memories of being under the hood. Too funny! But it is so true!
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x pilot
Guest





Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 9:56 pm 

NAV/ GPS switch to NAV

runway heading SET in course window on the autopilot!

Bring up the GPS, if your flight is in flight planner or the like press PROCC on the gps, in will come up with a SELECT APP, scroll down to the correct APP, press ENTER on the GPS, it will then say LOAD or ACTIVATE, scroll to ACTIVATE then press enter...

then press route on the gps and go back to the map view, scroll around the different info windows on the GPS, find the one with all the airport frequency's, when on this window you might need to press CLR then scoll down to the runway you are landing on, check out the freq, ie rwy 09L 110.30

enter this freq into you NAV 1 radio and make sure its the ACTIVE frequncy, FD on, VOR set with heading ete etc

go back to the ROUTE page on the GPS, check where you are and the approach should set and hightlighted etc etc to use as a cross ref...

i hope this makes sence?

let me know how it goes,

cheers
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x pilot
Guest





Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 10:02 pm 

Jellrod, i am glad you did it the vintage way too lol, my IF instructor didnt trust goggles so he cover the windshield with a broken down card borad box in a PA28, was fun as the instruments were as doddgy as the plane, when it worked i belive it is the best method and is a real good rush to pull the card down and there is the runway!
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jellrod
First Officer
First Officer

Pro Member

Joined: Mar 15, 2007
Posts: 260
Location: Seattle
Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 5:34 pm 

Oh yeah - xpilot. Surprise! There's the numbers! AS close to the way it would really be as you could get. I actually thought of investing in Jockey after the first few times...if you get my meaning.
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Reider
Guest





Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 2:01 am 

As an addition, give this a try.... I`ll use Rotterdam as an example, and this is flying the Boeing 737-800.

Imagine you`re flying in and control sets you to 2500 feet, not even lined up properly with the runway yet, doesn`t matter as long as you`re within 7-15NM. They tell you to maintain this altitude until you`re on the localizer.

Hopefully you`ve set the radio frequency up for Rotterdam and set the course heading.

NAV/GPS selector should be on NAV.

Autothrottle hold is on at about 145knots, flaps on 25deg.

Heading would be wherever you left it at this stage

Altitude hold is on

Go to the Garmin, select approach, enter the runway number control issued, but don`t pick ILS or anything, pick ROT and enter

Go back to the Garmin and set it to start the approach

Hit the NAV hold button on the panel and the heading hold will go out

At this point set the speedbrake, it will activate when the brakes are applied on the ground then. Set auto brakes as necessary.

The aircraft will turn of its own accord and line up with the runway. Having got to the right location, the altitude hold will extinguish and the downward glideslope will commence. No flaps or speed to adjust yet. Make sure undercarriage has been lowered, landing lights on etc..... 200 feet from the runway turn off the autothrottle and the autopilot.

Apply the brakes, if the speedbrake was armed this will start on application of the brakes. If going too fast then hit the reverse thrust and keep hitting it til you stop, then release before you go backwards.

As a second example, all of the above but fly to Humberside airport in the UK. The part of the plate to set in The Garmin (we used ROT before) is KIM and the NAV radio frequency to set is 108.75

Reider
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Guest






Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 8:39 am 

It was around 3am when I worded this so excuse these two minor corrections.....

Reider wrote:

Go to the Garmin, select approach, enter the runway number control issued, but don`t pick ILS or anything, pick ROT and enter


should read at the point where you pick for example ILS RW09, do that but when you normally set VECTORS then set ROT instead or KIM as in the second example.

Reider wrote:

Hopefully you`ve set the radio frequency up for Rotterdam and set the course heading.


One area you may fail here is to set the nav radio frequency but forget to come back just before you hit the NAV Hold and hit the black square button. If you have done it and in range then the bleeper will start (morse code), if you don`t hear the bleeper and in range then you haven`t set it correctly.

Reider[/b]
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