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ATI 9800pro was (for me) a complete waste of time & mone

   
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Rambunctious
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Joined: Mar 29, 2003
Posts: 110
Location: Sydney
Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2004 5:14 am 

I have had "experts" giving me tips on how this card can actually outperform my puny 11 fps onboard system (ASROCK GPRO V) so many times, I feel like I'm going crazy.

I'm getting intermittent pauses (not from OBV), and black screen resets that are not even close to the limit I had with the puny onboard adapter unit.

Micro$oft doesn't know how they can possibly help me, other than take more money from me, to continue their good work.

While the screenrates are up to around 23fps, I don't get the point if it's crashing half the time.

I know that the MB is not the prob, since it was transplanted 6 mths ago into another machine, which worked really well.
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harleyman
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Posts: 195
Location: Statesville NC
Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2004 12:51 pm 

I had the same card with the same prob...I ended up taking the entire puter I had built back and told them what I thought about the card they recomended..........

ATI offered no help at all.......


RadarMan has that card,and loves it......

I got a G-Force 5700 Ultra and am almost happy.......


MS tech help sucks too......Thats a fact...... Shocked
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RadarMan
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Posts: 19130
Location: U.S.A
Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2004 3:54 pm 

These are the install instructions from ATI, follow them exactly.
If you still have problems please explain them more clearly.

Download Instructions:

Please read all Release Notes as they may contain additional details/notes specific to the version driver/software you are installing.
Create a central location for all your downloads
Right-Click your DESKTOP and select "NEW" and then "FOLDER"
Name the folder "ATI Downloads"
Click on the hyperlink (i.e. Display Driver)
A "File Download" dialogue box will appear
Select the "SAVE" button
A "Save As" window should appear
Browse to the folder you created
Select the "SAVE" button
Installation Instructions:
NOTE: Ensure that you have logged onto the system with Administrative rights if you are using Windows 2000/XP


Uninstall the ATI Display Driver
Restart once prompted. If prompted cancel the installation of the display adapter upon boot up.
Close all other applications running, including any anti-virus software before attempting to install the driver suite.

Windows 2000/XP:
You can confirm that all applications are closed using the Windows Task Manager.
Press CTRL+ALT+DEL once and then click Task Manager. Select the "Applications" tab. If any applications are still listed on this tab, highlight the application and then click the "End Task" button at the bottom of the tab. Repeat this procedure until there are no more applications running.


Windows 98/SE/ME:
Press CTRL+ALT+DEL once. Highlight each application and then click the "End Task" button at the bottom of this window. Repeat this procedure until there are no more applications running except for EXPLORER & SYSTRAY. Do NOT end task on these two applications or your PC will shut down.


Locate the Display Driver download and double-click on it.
Restart once prompted.
Locate the ATI Control Panel (if included) download and double-click on it.
Restart once prompted.
Locate the WDM Capture drivers and double-click on it. - ONLY download if you have an AIW RADEON or RADEON VIVO family product.
Restart once prompted
******************************************
Make certain that you have service pack 1 and Directx (the latest).

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows/products/windows-xp
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jetman35
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Joined: Feb 18, 2004
Posts: 221
Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2004 6:12 pm 

I have the 9600SE and it works pretty good!! It can be a little tricky getting the board to work correctly though. My PC do not have expansion slots. I had to make sure I deleted the current vid driver before installing the new drivers. My card works great with no hangups for half the price of the 9800pro. You may want to consider downloading the lastest and greatest drivers for the 9800pro. I did not even use the software that 9600se came with. I had to download the lastest ver from ATI website.

I would love to have the 9800pro that Radarman has but did not want to spend that much for a new board. It helps to have 512 Megs of RAM and a fast CPU.

Just my 2 cents

Jetman Cool
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Guest






Posted: Sun Apr 25, 2004 5:04 pm 

I have an ATI Radeon 9800 PRO
I never had any problems with this video card.
I play regular games,flightsims and rpg's and
I like the graphics with this video card and
when I'm using Photoshop I also are
satisfied with my ATI Radeon 9800 PRO.
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Furia
Guest





Posted: Tue Apr 27, 2004 9:26 am 

I have an ATI Raedon 9800 PRO. It works real nice with most programs but so far I still do not know how to get the best of MS Flight Simulator 2004. The Cockpits quality althought not terrible is not what I expected.
I am using the latest Catalyst drivers but I had the same perfomance with older ones.
I guess I could set better settings on ATI control panel and MS Flight simulator hardware settings as well to make it run better.
What are the settings you recommend for this?

Thank you Smile
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RadarMan
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Posts: 19130
Location: U.S.A
Posted: Tue Apr 27, 2004 3:55 pm 

Furia wrote:
I have an ATI Raedon 9800 PRO. It works real nice with most programs but so far I still do not know how to get the best of MS Flight Simulator 2004. The Cockpits quality althought not terrible is not what I expected.
I am using the latest Catalyst drivers but I had the same perfomance with older ones.
I guess I could set better settings on ATI control panel and MS Flight simulator hardware settings as well to make it run better.
What are the settings you recommend for this?

Thank you Smile


I have it set at 4xAA-16xAF and 1600x1200x32, don't check the AA box in the Sim itself.
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Rambunctious
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Joined: Mar 29, 2003
Posts: 110
Location: Sydney
Posted: Sat May 08, 2004 8:27 am 

RadarMan wrote:
These are the install instructions from ATI, follow them exactly.
If you still have problems please explain them more clearly.

http://www.microsoft.com/download/en/details.aspx?id=35


I've been away, so thanks for your replies in the interim. I have done exactly what you (& ATI in a roundabout kind of way) have described.

The machine still crashes, even on things like Wolfenstein, which has never crashed on me before, and is frankly, beginning to drive me insane...

As HM has noted, ATI doesn't support its customers at all. Emails with the complete, agonising story warrant no reply whatsoever from the company.

All I can say to anyone contemplating this card, is think very carefully if it's not a complete system you can take back for repair.

I can't describe the problem any more than the (numerous) people I have read since I left the forum last time have - Play the game, after xminutes, the game either just disappears, or the machine reboots with a "serious error" report. Before installing the 9800, (onboard 64M dudvision), the only time the machine would crash is when I had traffic turned up, and during one specific scenario only (cargo pilot, LHR-somethingorother). I sent ATI 2,5 pages, and they haven't dignified it with a response.

The machine is clean, there are no resident tsr's, or virii. The drivers for everything are up to date. I even went to the lengths of installing everything on an old AMD 1,6, and transplanting one piece of software/hardware at a time to it (sure, I had some spare time!). No luck at all, the AMD ran fine, but slow...
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RadarMan
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Posts: 19130
Location: U.S.A
Posted: Sat May 08, 2004 5:06 pm 

Rambunctious,
Why don't you list all your computer specs so we can get a better idea of what you are working with.
If you can also give us word for word what the "error report" is that can help also.
You said that you moved the mobo from another machine, did you upgrade the bios.
I hope we can help, with my old ATI I couldn't run anything new, now I tried the demo of Panzer and Far Cry and the machine ran like a champ. By the way Panzer is a rehash of the old "A Bridge to Far", good for it's time but old now.
Did you run AdAware http://www.lavasoft.com/

Nice to see you back Exclamation
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Rambunctious
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Posts: 110
Location: Sydney
Posted: Mon May 10, 2004 12:29 am 

Thanks for your input, Radar.

You'll have to forgive me for sounding more than a little exasperated/P'DO... But this is really frustrating. I post for the general benefit of everyone though, and am not simply whingeing, or throwing my hands up over this!

I've had a guy I used to work with when I upgraded laptops tell me that the problem could lie in the power supply rating (GRRRRR - the only thing I haven't changed/checked yet.). He's couriering a 550w ps for me to try. Since then, I've had a logging DVM on all the dc rails, and either there is a bad connector in there, or something is loading the system extremely. I'm pretty sure it's out of tolerance - 5V rail can fluctuate +/- 0,25V

Specs:
P4 2,4G
ASrock Gpro integrated MB
300w PS (the main suspect at the moment)
Defragged & lots of space HDD
was 512M, now 1G RAM Tested OK
ATI 9800 pro
Lifeview TV (checked installed & not)
Full AVG, Adaware, Spywareblaster (V.good) - Green scans
Win XP pro SP1, all security updated to last week
No dodgy spyware-laden, "Ware2" or susFreeware titles onboard
All current drivers, including SiS BIOS

Error:
- Program usually just disappears at a point where there is a high CPU/memory load. That's all.

- Sometimes, the machine will reboot, even though it's been told not to (on error) in the setup. The only message is the good ol' "Windows has recovered from a serious error" please tell Microsoft about this. It's just machine code addresses & gobbledegook that I doubt anyone here could interpret.

I'll let all know how the PS upgrade goes... I'm not going to hold my breath though!
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RadarMan
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Posts: 19130
Location: U.S.A
Posted: Mon May 10, 2004 1:02 am 

Rambunctious,
I hope it works for you but while upgrading everything in my computer when I bought it, the only thing I forgot about was the p/s and the oem version is (I think 250w) and I have a barrel full of usb items that drain it.

Did you try any of this.



http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;837195
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Guest






Posted: Sat May 29, 2004 3:58 pm 

Rambunctious wrote:
RadarMan wrote:
These are the install instructions from ATI, follow them exactly.
If you still have problems please explain them more clearly.

http://www.microsoft.com/download/en/details.aspx?id=35


I've been away, so thanks for your replies in the interim. I have done exactly what you (& ATI in a roundabout kind of way) have described.

The machine still crashes, even on things like Wolfenstein, which has never crashed on me before, and is frankly, beginning to drive me insane...

As HM has noted, ATI doesn't support its customers at all. Emails with the complete, agonising story warrant no reply whatsoever from the company.

All I can say to anyone contemplating this card, is think very carefully if it's not a complete system you can take back for repair.

I can't describe the problem any more than the (numerous) people I have read since I left the forum last time have - Play the game, after xminutes, the game either just disappears, or the machine reboots with a "serious error" report. Before installing the 9800, (onboard 64M dudvision), the only time the machine would crash is when I had traffic turned up, and during one specific scenario only (cargo pilot, LHR-somethingorother). I sent ATI 2,5 pages, and they haven't dignified it with a response.

The machine is clean, there are no resident tsr's, or virii. The drivers for everything are up to date. I even went to the lengths of installing everything on an old AMD 1,6, and transplanting one piece of software/hardware at a time to it (sure, I had some spare time!). No luck at all, the AMD ran fine, but slow...
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Guest






Posted: Sun Jun 06, 2004 1:42 am 

[RadarMan] and others ...

After installing an ati radeon9800 pro into my otherwise perfect system (it was replacing an nvidia card that never gave any problems!), I've had nothing but trouble! The card was brand new .. so no problems there.
ATI support .. does it exist? .. not for us poor end users (because we dont dont pay for it like big companies do!). However I put up with it for a month or so, constantly crashing when playing games (it was fine while using windows otherwise!). After a while I thought It must be a conflict with the driver in windows etc .. so I formatted and re-installed XP .. only to find that its still the same Sad ...
I'm a qualified software engineer and I come from an engineering background and all I can deduce is that ATI quality is crap!
As for all the gumpf one has to go through to get an ATI installed on ones system all I can say is why??? why does the end user have to do all the crap that a half decent install program should do?
Wtf is wrong with these ATI people??????
We pay damn good money and get shite for it ... I've lost a shit load of data because or there incompetance ... where is the justice, they should be looked at by the industries standards boards or similar! (Problem is that they've paid them to keep quite ... GRRRRRRR)

When the world stops being everyones sucker we might get some quality !

~S~
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crj700
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Joined: Jul 20, 2004
Posts: 1
Posted: Wed Jul 21, 2004 6:57 pm 

Guys, guys, guys.... First post in this forum, but I know a lot about the 9800PRO. 2 caracteristics about that card:

1. Power-hungry. The molex connector is not just another fancy add-on. The card needs a 400W (minimum) PSU in order to run smoothly.

2. The damn thing runs hot. 55C to 70C are common temps. Good cooling is a must; RAMsinks are required, both sides of the card. Add a case fan right on top of the card (my case has an opening at the right location) and you're in business.

My card is a BBA 9800PRO (XT PCB) flashed to XT, running at 465/369 stable. But I've got the fan located as above, RAMsinks and water-cooling. With that set-up I rarely see temps above 40C.

The error that you encounter is the videocard running too hot. Simple as that. Better cooling should solve the issue.

Hope this helps.

JF
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Rambunctious
First Officer
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Joined: Mar 29, 2003
Posts: 110
Location: Sydney
Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2004 8:10 am 

crj700 wrote:
The error that you encounter is the videocard running too hot. Simple as that. Better cooling should solve the issue.


Actually, it most probably won't solve the issue. Just because you had an overheating problem, doesn't explain the plethora (not here) of other problems regarding the card, and its manufacturer. My machine [was] "water" (& ethyl glycol) cooled as well, and that wasn't the problem.

Stay away from ATI
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RadarMan
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Posts: 19130
Location: U.S.A
Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2004 5:14 pm 

Rambunctious,
Sorry you had so many problems with ATI but if I had to do it all over again I'd buy my 9800 again.
The next card will be an ATI also.
Yep it runs hot but so do I sometimes (fortunately). Clapping


Radar

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Arkydave
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Joined: Feb 24, 2004
Posts: 143
Location: SE Iowa, USA
Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2004 6:38 pm 

RadarMan wrote:
Rambunctious,
Sorry you had so many problems with ATI but if I had to do it all over again I'd buy my 9800 again.
The next card will be an ATI also.
Yep it runs hot but so do I sometimes (fortunately). Clapping


Radar
I've been running hot recently, but I believe it has something to do with that Mexican food I ate. Oops!
I want to die peacefully in my sleep, like my father did, not screaming and terrified like his passengers.
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Rambunctious
First Officer
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Joined: Mar 29, 2003
Posts: 110
Location: Sydney
Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2004 9:32 am 

Yay! I'm back, and flying literally & figuratively... The card works flawlessly in my new AMD 64 3400+.

Now to overclock the bejeezus out of the old pentium 2.4b and see what she's really got Twisted Evil
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fezza
Guest





Posted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 10:46 am 

Twisted Evil hello evryone i got the 9800pro last weak and have had nothing but problems constant crash to black screen some times it wont get past the windows screen i am not a happy bunny at all Evil or Very Mad
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RadarMan
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Posts: 19130
Location: U.S.A
Posted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 3:20 pm 

fezza,
Did the sim ever work on this machine. Did it work before you put the new card in.
If so did you connect the card to the power, do you have DirectX 9.0c, do you have a folder in your "My Documents" that is Flight Simulator.

What drivers are you using.



Radar

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Rambunctious
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Posts: 110
Location: Sydney
Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2004 4:07 am 

fezza wrote:
Twisted Evil hello evryone i got the 9800pro last weak and have had nothing but problems constant crash to black screen some times it wont get past the windows screen i am not a happy bunny at all Evil or Very Mad


Mate, the most probable cause of your problem is an underrated power supply. That was the issue with my 2,4G P4 300w system, I didn't have 5 CD drives hooked up to it either.

For what, $20 US at the most, you can get a generic 500w PSU off ebay. It'll be the cheapest aspirin you can take.

If you want to completely isolate the issue, back up & re-load windows, SP1 & FS9 only. Then you will clear driver/compatibility issues.

If the molex connector isn't plugged in, it won't get past the POST, so that's unlikely to be you problem.
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ATIGUY
Guest





Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2005 4:40 pm 

Hi Guys, it seems that power was just touched upon.....but, if your crashing in high load type games, photo editing etc. it sounds like a PS issue to me. I have seen many users upgrade their pc's and never touch the PS. Next thing you know they are pissed at something because the pc starts to crash randomly, in games sending you to desktop, or worse BSOD and restart.
Remember, if you put in power hogs....ie. vid card, sound card, etc you need to think about power, and now days with all the improvements to all pc enviroments, you need a minimum of 400 watts to run your engine clean.
Don't be afraid of power it is a pc's friend. Get a new PS and I bet your problems go away..........
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resincake
Guest





Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 6:35 pm 

I have exacty same problem ..

AMD Sempron 2800+
512 DDR400
Sapphire 8500 Pro
SB Audigy
7200rpm (80gb)

I got this card today, because my old 8500 kept overheating (exact same probs as all have specified above.), but the fan on the 8500 was missing a few blades. I presumed that was the reason. So I got myself a nice new 9800 pro today. Installed it. ran a high-end game to test it, and 10 mins later .. computer froze .. AHHHHH .. tried everything ..reduce AGP to 4x, turn off fast writes, etc ..

Oh, and I have a 550 watt PS, also brand new today. After my machine freezes, I checked the card, and the fan was not even going round !! It was at first, Ihad checked. I let it cool down for 10 mins, then retried it. The fan worked ok, but sure enough, 10 mins later .. computer froze and the cards fan had stopped again .. It is only happening in intensive games (or 3D Mark) .. so .. I know for a fact it is not AGP speed, and no way is it PS .. I have one of the highest watts you can get atm .. so ATiguy .. you are wrong ..

It is definately overheating .. cause I reckon if the fan stayed on it would work .. but why does it stop after intense usage? makes no sense ..

well .. I am gong to return this card tomorrow .. The 9800 pro obviously has major problems with something ... and if ATI cant (be bothered) to help, then what chance have we got of curing it .. As far as I can see we all have different systems, other than the 9800 pro (or other 9xxx 8xxx radeons) .. Speaks for itself really ..

9800 load of crap (would be good if it worked)
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RadarMan
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Posts: 19130
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Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 7:06 pm 

resincake,
Return it and get one with a fan that works. Nothing is perfect and your the one that was unlucky enough to get a card with a bad fan, don't let that discourage you.


Radar

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captain jack
Guest





Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 12:37 am 

resincake wrote:
I have exacty same problem ..

AMD Sempron 2800+
512 DDR400
Sapphire 8500 Pro
SB Audigy
7200rpm (80gb)

I got this card today, because my old 8500 kept overheating (exact same probs as all have specified above.), but the fan on the 8500 was missing a few blades. I presumed that was the reason. So I got myself a nice new 9800 pro today. Installed it. ran a high-end game to test it, and 10 mins later .. computer froze .. AHHHHH .. tried everything ..reduce AGP to 4x, turn off fast writes, etc ..

Oh, and I have a 550 watt PS, also brand new today. After my machine freezes, I checked the card, and the fan was not even going round !! It was at first, Ihad checked. I let it cool down for 10 mins, then retried it. The fan worked ok, but sure enough, 10 mins later .. computer froze and the cards fan had stopped again .. It is only happening in intensive games (or 3D Mark) .. so .. I know for a fact it is not AGP speed, and no way is it PS .. I have one of the highest watts you can get atm .. so ATiguy .. you are wrong ..

It is definately overheating .. cause I reckon if the fan stayed on it would work .. but why does it stop after intense usage? makes no sense ..

well .. I am gong to return this card tomorrow .. The 9800 pro obviously has major problems with something ... and if ATI cant (be bothered) to help, then what chance have we got of curing it .. As far as I can see we all have different systems, other than the 9800 pro (or other 9xxx 8xxx radeons) .. Speaks for itself really ..

9800 load of crap (would be good if it worked)



I had the same problem, i overclocked the beast and it now works great. It was surprisingly simple to clock tbh.
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captain jack
Guest





Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 12:39 am 

The problem I am now having is getting the vidoe capture to work. I can record a black screen wit hgreat sound. all I get is black screen. dont know if its the drivers or what?
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Greekman72
Chief Captain
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Joined: Jun 15, 2005
Posts: 7050
Location: Hellas
Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 7:32 am 

What video capture program are you using?
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HardLanding
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Joined: Oct 10, 2005
Posts: 117
Location: Brooklyn
Posted: Fri Dec 09, 2005 12:23 pm 

Rambunctious, I'm not a GPU expert and don't want to prejudice anyone against ATI products, but.... I've been using a new Connect3D
X800GTO for not quite two weeks now, and I expected a much more dramatic improvement in performance over my older Chaintech V3 Volari budget card. It certainly is better, but less than the ecstatic tests on various websites would suggest, getting settings just right has been a very finicky process (I'm still struggling with that), and as someone said, ATI doesn't reply to e-mail requests for advice.

Don't know if, as a company or the general product line, NVidia is any better.

HL
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Greekman72
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Joined: Jun 15, 2005
Posts: 7050
Location: Hellas
Posted: Fri Dec 09, 2005 12:52 pm 

In an older post of mine i was refering to this tests issue my friend Hardlanding and i have to notice again that my personal opinion is to be very very careful about what we read and from where we read it.

We can take as example hundreds maybe thousands of cases which some magazines are promoted a product in deal with the manufacturer and cheat us about the quality of the products.

Im an Nvidia fun for a simple reason.This reason isnt the price,the performance,the after sales or anything else of these...I think that all manufacturers are very close between them and the differencies are minor and sometimes we cant understand them.The only reason is that my first VGA was Nvidia and i was very satisfied so i continue buying the Nvidia chipset for my visual satisfaction(im on the third one).I bet that this could happen to me if i has an ATI one and it was the same...faith... to me.If i had a problem with some of them of course i will change my mind but in no case this doesnt means that the whole stock was rubbish...
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