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major new pc problems. your expert help is greatly requested

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

I finally received my new computer on sunday. I have had a few minor problems since, but nothing too bad, however now I have had a serious problem:
My graphics card is a radeon x1300 series, with 512mb

I was having a look at some of the screen-savers that came with my computer. there are a few that are very cool, but, I guess very quite challenging on graphics. I tried some, and every time they would work ok for about 10 seconds, then they would freeze, and after about a 15 second wait it would return to my normal screen and a message would come up saying something like:
We have reset your graphics acclerator because it is no longer responding to commands from your graphics drives.
I eventually gave up on this and tried flight simulator for the first time on my new pc. before it loaded it gave me a message about drivers.
my computer came with a cd that said xpert vision on it, however I guessed (and I still think) that it had been installed on to my computer before I got it, so I have not tried to install it.
anyway, I followed the instructions and downloaded the latest drivers from the website.
After this flight sim loaded fine. I set my settings quite high, but perfectly within range of my computer. The flight loaded fine, but when I was on the runway, the whole thing froze. after a couple of minutes the computer restarted. something along these lines has happened before, at the welcome page: the pc will freze (but not the mouse,) and then after a little while restart. the same thing also happened when I was typing this post. I am guessing that this is related to the grapihcs, but am not sure. When I log on afterwards, I get the message: system has recovered from a serious error, send report to microsoft?
I am completely at a loss of what to do. I will try the cd, but dont expect any results. the customer service is hopeless. they take ages to respond to emails, and on the phone tell me to email them for any technical problems.
Any help you can give is very, very much appreciated, sorry for keeping your time in writing such a long post.
Mossy.

Pro Member Captain
ARD-DC Captain

I'm so sorry to hear; having problems like that on a new PC is every gamers (and simmer, I suppose Wink ) worst nightmare.

You're probably right about the problem being related to graphics; what drivers are you using now?

The latest ATI drivers had some (denied) bugs in them, and caused me to revert to an earlier version that worked fine for me (fine in terms of no unexpected crashes).

Some point in the past when I also had some unexplained weird errors that I Isolated to being graphics-related, were fixed by uninstalling the old drivers and installing the Omega Drivers.

If you're hesitant to play around;

Create a system restore point, then make sure you have all the files you need (Omega Drivers installer, .NET Framework installer, Catalyst installer).

Reboot, uninstall current drivers, reboot, install Omega Drivers, see how it works.

There are some that recommend using Driver Cleaning utilities after uninstalling the old, and before installing the new drivers, but I've become a bit uncomfortable with such utilities after they screwed up on me on some occasions; I prefer to first manually check which drivers are in use, then after the uninstall, verify they have actually been removed.

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

I downloaded the latest ati drivers, although I think I already had them on my computer from the cd.
I am not very good at some of this technical stuff, so I apologise if these questions are very basic:
What is the net. framework installer, and how do I check if I have it?
How do I create a system restore point?

Pro Member Captain
ARD-DC Captain

The .NET Framework is an MS Component required for the Catalyst software to run I believe. Never checked what it really does, but anyway - you need it installed before you can install the more recent ATI Drivers.

Funny thing: The latest version of .NET ( I think it was 2.0, not sure) had a ... we'll call it a "design feature" (don't want to use the word "bug" on MS Products Razz) that, in SOME (note: not all) cases caused the ATI drivers to produce some very odd error that seemed completely unrelated to .NET.

However, uninstalling .NET 2.0 (?) and reverting back to the earlier version, version 1.1 completely fixed that problem. I don't know the actual status of .NET at the moment, and whether or not that error in it was ever fixed, but in my experience (and, according to various support forums, many others with me) the ATI drivers work fine with .NET version 1.1.

If you have .NET installed it should be listed in the "Add/Remove Programs" section in your configuration panel.

A system restore point can be made by going to START Menu -> Accessories -> System Tools -> System Restore or by running C:\WINDOWS\system32\Restore\rstrui.exe

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

I looked in add/remove programs, I have both versions 2 and 1.1 installed. I will try what you suggested if the driver change dosen't work.
I clicked on the link to the driver page, and I cant find the link to the download. where is it?

Pro Member Captain
ARD-DC Captain

Hmm...it'd strike me as odd that you would require two versions of .NET.
Might want to uninstall 1.1 (see how 2 works for you first)

The Omega download section for Windows XP (I assume you have that) is here Arrow
http://www.omegadrivers.net/ati/win2k_xp.php

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

Thankyou ARD-DC for your help so far.

I uninstalled current drivers, rebooted, everything was very big on the screen. I downloaded the new drivers, rebooted, and eveything was back to normal. I uninstalled 1.1, and rebooted, however the problem persists. Whenever I try to do anything involving moving graphics, my computer either restarts, or gives me the 'drivers lost control message.' The ATI program seems still to be on my computer, at least the icon is there, but when I click on it nothing happens.
I am at a loss of what to do, other than send a rude email to the company and threaten to send the computer back if they do not help.

Pro Member Chief Captain
Tailhook Chief Captain

ARD-DC wrote:

Hmm...it'd strike me as odd that you would require two versions of .NET.
Might want to uninstall 1.1 (see how 2 works for you first)

The Omega download section for Windows XP (I assume you have that) is here Arrow
http://www.omegadrivers.net/ati/win2k_xp.php

Apologies for butting in here but I've been following this thread with interest. I too have 1.1 and 2.0 installed. Some of the programs I've installed require v2.0 - but (from memory) I think it was Lee Swordy's Traffic Tools that required v1.1 -- odd. Haven't found an answer to the mystery yet.
BTW ARD-DC, I recall you asking in one of your posts about advantages of Vista over XP - an article I read claimed that the Microsoft .NET Framework would no longer be an issue as it is an integral part of Vista.

I leave you guys to it Umm...

Pro Member Captain
ARD-DC Captain

Tailhook wrote:

ARD-DC wrote:

Hmm...it'd strike me as odd that you would require two versions of .NET.
Might want to uninstall 1.1 (see how 2 works for you first)

The Omega download section for Windows XP (I assume you have that) is here Arrow
http://www.omegadrivers.net/ati/win2k_xp.php

Apologies for butting in here but I've been following this thread with interest. I too have 1.1 and 2.0 installed. Some of the programs I've installed require v2.0 - but (from memory) I think it was Lee Swordy's Traffic Tools that required v1.1 -- odd. Haven't found an answer to the mystery yet.
BTW ARD-DC, I recall you asking in one of your posts about advantages of Vista over XP - an article I read claimed that the Microsoft .NET Framework would no longer be an issue as it is an integral part of Vista.

I leave you guys to it Umm...

Well, I'm not an expert and perhaps there are good reasons to have both, but you'll agree that generally, having two versions of one program installed more often gives trouble than improvements Smile

By all means do post ideas if you have them, I value your opinon and suggestions.

Nice plus about Vista you mention there, that at least is a true improvement (I dont care much about the improved looks etc. - in fact Ill probably strip out as much as possible of the fancy stuff once I do switch
to Vista Smile )

Now as far as the incooperative computer goes...

Mossy - Does your eventlog show any useful information about the systemcrashes?

It can be found by right-clicking on My Computer -> Manage -> then select "System Tools"-> "Event Viewer"

Checkout the System and Application sections, you should see entries at the times your computer crashed, hopefully with some useful information as to what caused the crash.

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

I had a look in the event log. there are 5 catergories. these are:
ACEEvent log
Application
Media centre
Security
System

ACEEvent log has many entries. when I click on these I get a message like this, or with something else mentioning graphics mainly:

The description for Event ID ( 0 ) in Source ( ACEEventLogSource ) cannot be found. The local computer may not have the necessary registry information or message DLL files to display messages from a remote computer. You may be able to use the /AUXSOURCE= flag to retrieve this description; see Help and Support for details. The following information is part of the event: 0000000002: 2007-02-21 19:20:24:390 RT_GraphicsCaste : Cound not initialize adapter 0 named Radeon X1300 Series
Error Called by: ATI.ACE.CLI.Caste.Graphics.Runtime.RT_GraphicsCaste::Initialize processID:01624 threadID:(CLIRuntime ) domainName:(CLI.EXE ) assemblyName:(CLI.Caste.Graphics.Runtime, Version=1.2.2545.38890, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=90ba9c70f846762e)

Applications does not seem to show any errors

Media centre says no items to show

Security says no items to show

System seems mainly irrelevant, however there seem to be a few that might be helpful. here are some of them:

Error code 100000ea, parameter1 8980a810, parameter2 89b88dc8, parameter3 bace7cbc, parameter4 00000001.

The driver ati2dvag for the display device \Device\Video0 got stuck in an infinite loop. This usually indicates a problem with the device itself or with the device driver programming the hardware incorrectly. Please check with your hardware device vendor for any driver updates.

These both came with links to a web page. The first link told me nothing, but the second link suggested I had outdated drivers and should upgrade them. However, I downloaded the latest ones before swapping the, for the Omega drivers.

I have sent an email to the company outlining the problem, however I have not yet received a reply.
Thanks for your help so far.

Pro Member Captain
brownbox Captain

hmmmm, this problems got me stumped.

Sounds to me like either
1. You somehow got a bad video card. I highly doubt it though.
2. Try re installing directx 9
3. Perhaps your motherboard has a bug in it with something to do with the PCI Express slot. A BIOS update could fix this problem.
4. Try updating all of your drivers
5. Try setting your BIOS to failsafe defaults.

Edit: I just thought of this idea. Does the motherboard have an onboard video card? If so, this could be causing your card to have problems. Entering the BIOS and disabling the onboard video would help if this is the problem.

I hope this helps somehow.

CHeers
BB

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

Yes, my motherboard has an intergrated graphics card, which means you may have found the root of the problem. Could someone please tell me:
Where can I find the directx9 download?
What is a BIOS?
How do update my BIOS?
How do I enter the BIOS?

Pro Member Chief Captain
CRJCapt Chief Captain

mossy wrote:

Where can I find the directx9 download?

Arrow default.mspx

mossy wrote:

What is a BIOS?

Arrow http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BIOS

mossy wrote:

How do update my BIOS?

Check your computer manufacturers site for BIOS update file(s ), rarely needed.

mossy wrote:

How do I enter the BIOS?

I don't know.

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

oh oh, think I could have done something seriously wrong. I entered the bios setup (at startup,) and looked for a way to change the graphics settings. In the 'advanced' section, I finally found something that allowed me to select my graphics device. the options were: Intergrated, PCI, PCI with some letters I cant remember after it. The setting was the PCI with some letters after it. to see if it would work, I selected PCI. Now my pc screen is turningh on and off, showing nothing but black. What have I done?

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

Good news and double portion of bad news. I will start with the good news:
I opened the box and looked at the graphics card. all seems well so it would suggest that I havent blown the card. (phew, else it would be 60ish down the drain)

Bad news 1: The black screen problem persists. Nothing I do seems to help, so I will speak to my school technician, and see if he has any suggestions, otherwise I will have to take it to a proffesional (urgh, more money out of my already drained bank account)

Bad news 2: I made this problem myself, so the coverage that came with the computer wont (I think) cover this

The only solution I can think of is to buy a new motherboard or a new rom chip, both of which I am loath to do. Anyone who can solve this problem I will be grateful to if not for ever then for a very, very long time.

Pro Member Captain
ARD-DC Captain

Well - I've been taught a lesson here as well, the idea of onboard graphics possibly interfering crossed my mind right at the start, but I left that at the side from the beginning thinking "naaahhhh....can't imagine on-board is enabled".

Glad BB asked, seen as that it seems there is something to look at in that area after all.

If the black screen has been triggered by you accidentially activating the on-board graphics, (but this does not seem to be the case as you said you selected "PCI" and not "integrated") this could quite easily cause interference with the ATI Card. This could be resolved by physically removing the ATI card from your computer, leaving the computer with only one available GPU (the on-board one) and then plugging your monitor into the connector of the on-board adapter. Re-enter BIOS, reset the active adapter to PCI-X16 or whatever it was, re-fit ATI card, reconnect monitor and it should be OK.

However, unfortunately it looks like you have activated a non-existent graphics adapter (PCI), so in that sense it's completely normal the computer does not display any image, as it is trying to use non-present hardware.

Before going any further, just try to connect your monitor to the connector of your on-board graphics card (check the back of the PC, if you have an integrated graphics adapter there should be 2 places you can plug your monitor in to) just to make sure its not the on-board adapter that is currently active.

If that does not work, and you do not want to bring your PC to a shop just yet, you can (AT YOUR OWN RISK - I truly hate to say this but I am NOT taking any responsibility) force a BIOS Reset, restoring the factory settings.
This is obviously not a common practise, but may be required as a last resort.
Now, what this "Bios Reset" does, is restoring the original factory settings, nothing more, nothing less. In itself, harmless.
As a result, any custom settings now active in the BIOS (if there are any at all) will be lost and will have to be redefined. This is normal, and not a "bad" thing; they are the factory, non-optimized settings. Your computer will work with them.

If however you don't use your head, and go messing about in the internals of your PC with force, or start pulling wires at random etc. obviously things will go wrong, hence me stating I am not accepting any responsibility here (gotta be sure, right? Wink) but if you use your brain, and do not do things you are not sure about, you and your PC will be fine.

Grab your motherboards manual (if you threw it away, shame on you. Always save the documentation and the CD's that came with your computer! Smile ) and look for a section about the BIOS, there will be instructions on how to force a reset.

This - to my knowledge - can be done in two ways, : The first is to remove the backup battery, if your motherboard has one.
Look for a typical "watch-like-battery" (the flat ones that are commonly found in watches, only 10x bigger), pull it out, wait 5 seconds, put it back in, close case, connect power cord and switch on computer.

Second way is a bit trickier, and is done by changing jumper settings.

There will in this case be a small jumper located somewhere on your motherboard (manual will tell you where) that you will have to replace from default setting to "Reset BIOS" setting for a short while.
Again, the manual will have the details on how this is done.

Just a general tip, before opening your computer case, would you decide to do so, ensure to remove the power cord, and then touch a grounded object to ensure any static energy built up in your body is released (generated by synthetic-fiber clothing for example).

The result can be either of two things; either your mobo is using the on-board graphics adapter again, and you should have image when you have your monitor plugged into the on-board graphics adapter connector, Or it has recognised the card in the PCI-E slot, and is giving image over our ATI card.

Re-enter BIOS, go back to the advanced tab, and this time, select the "PCI-with-some-letters" option- probably PCIE-x16 or a combination of those characters.

Finally, I very very highly doubt you have destroyed anything, you have just activated some settings that basically rendered the computer useless.

To sum it up, what I would do if you gave me your computer to have a look at

- Try the monitor on the on-board adapter
- Remove ATI card and try monitor on on-board adapter again
- Reset Bios, try monitor on on-board adapter again
- re-fit ATI Card, try monitor on ATI card

Anyone who's got anything to add, or to correct, please do so.
I'm no computer-scientist Smile, just an amateur who has hobby'd around a little bit over the years.

Pro Member Captain
brownbox Captain

wooow, that was a long read. I would definately try the idea of taking your card out and plugging you monitor into the onboard card (the other monitor plug on the computer). If the monitor works still, it means that your onboard(AKA Integrated) card is still switched on.

mossy (havent logged on) Guest

I spoke to my school technician, and did what he said, similar to what you just told me to do (take out graphics card, plug monitor into other port, change bios to integrated, boot windows, shut down, plug in graphics card, boot windows, re-install it, reboot, change bios to pci, everything should work.) I am at the reinstall stage and am having trouble: When I booted windows, a message came up saying 'foung video controller, install software.' I made it search, but it found now software, even when I put the graphics card cd in. Then I recalled that the same messgae had come up when the graphics card was taken out, so it was probably reffering to something else, maybe the onboard one. I looked at the ATI cd, on it were some instructions which I followed, however, although it seemed to have installed nothing had happened. wanting to be sure, I put in the cd again, clicked on the uninstall button, rebooted when it had uninstalled, reinstalled. the message came up saying that the install had finished, and asking me to reboot, I clicked the reboot option on the message screen, and nothing happened. that is whene I am now. I think, just to be 100% that all has worked, I will go to add/remove programs, remove all the ati software, then reinstall.

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

ah well so far so good - everything is acting as it should, 1024 x 768 resolution, bios set on PCIE VGA (I looked up my graphics card, apparently it is the x1300 PCIE pro card, so I guessed PCIE was the right setting,) but, as far as I know (as yet I havent tried to run the screensavers, etc,) we still have not solved the first problem. I will download the directx9, and see if that works.

Jamie4590 Guest

I've noticed on the Microsoft site that there is recent update to Direct X9.0c. The problem I have is my home system is not internet equipped and to download the update I have to go through a license checking procedure to ensure my Windows is genuine. It is but how can I proove it without being on-line. I'll check at the Microsoft helpdesk but just wondered if anyone else had the same issue and knew of a resolution.

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

If you still have the manual/have the genuine copy sticker on the side of your pc, there should be a number on it that proves your copy is genuine.

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

PC back to normal but original problem not solved!
I finally managed to install everything. my computer found the software and installed the card, I downloaded the latest driver update,I installed the dierctx 9, all seemed good - my computer ran two of the screensavers well for a minute each before I closed them.
Now I have rebooted and it is back to before. this time, I dont get the 'drivers have lost control of accelerators message, The screen goes black for ages, then either rebbots or shows the noraml screen. Does anyone have anymore ideas of waht could be wrong, or should I assume the card is bust, ans ask the company to send me a new one (which I really dont want to di, it will take ages and will be a whole kefuffel.)

Thanks everyone for their help so far.

Pro Member Captain
brownbox Captain

lol, this is an interesting problem. Have you tried updating the BIOS?

First, what is your motherboard? Model number, manufacturer.

Also, how big is your power supply? It is possible that your power supply is too small, but I doubt it because the X1300 is just a little card Wink

mossy (haven't logged on) Guest

my power supply is I think 350 or 450 watts.

My motherboard is (I think, writing this at a friends house so cant check) the asus A8V-VM SE

Is the x1300 a good card? it seems powerful - 512mb, and its price seems to confirm that t is a good, middle rating card that should cope with most of what I throw at it. If it isnt, I can instead of sending it back (which seems at the moment the only option left,) I can ask for a refund and use the more money plus a bit more to buy a better card.

How do I update my BIOS?

Pro Member Captain
brownbox Captain

Heres the BIOS
http://support.asus.com/download/download.aspx?SLanguage=en-us
You will have to find your model but its pretty simple Wink Search motherboards, then socket 939 then your one.
Heres a direct link to the file
http://dlsvr01.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/socket939/A8V-VM_SE/A8V0405.zip

Please make sure that while you are updating your BIOS that there is minimal risk of your computer turning off! Any crash, power failure, or accidental nudge of the power cord could render your motherboard useless.

Before you update your BIOS, go to Start-Control Panel-System-Hardware-Device manager , and check there is no "Unknown Devices". If there is, they could be your problem. I would also try updating your sound drivers too. BIOS update is sort of a last attempt if all else fails. Wink

Or maybe, you could try a different card, saying that your one wouldnt go and you wish to change it for a different one? You may have got a bad video card.

Thats about all the advice I have. If it still doesnt work, Id consider taking it to a shop seeing as its a new computer anyway Cool

Good Luck
BB

Pro Member Captain
brownbox Captain

Also, see here for help on how to flash
http://support.asus.com/technicaldocuments/technicaldocuments.aspx?root=198&SLanguage=en-us

Im not sure which one yours though.

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

Do you reccomend that I update my BIOS first, or ask and try and get a new card first? (The companys customer service is abysmal, so it may take a while, also I will have to run of the integrated card for a while while they look at my card.)

Pro Member First Officer
mustangpilot First Officer

If it were me i would send the whole lot back with a covering letter and get my money back via credit card (if you paid that way) if they don't refund you.

Who sold you the machine? Just so others can avoid!

Pro Member Captain
brownbox Captain

if you got it from a local shop, I would take the computer back to them, and tell them to fix it for free. Surely it would be under warranty.

Do you reccomend that I update my BIOS first, or ask and try and get a new card first?

I wouldnt update the BIOS just yet, as we dont know if that is the problem.

As my saying goes, "If in doubt, let someone else break it". Take it back to the shop first, get them to take a look, and go from there Cool

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

I bought the computer from an online company, computerplanet.co.uk. I am very unhappy with their customer service - only technical advice through email, I sent the email about a week ago and stil no reply. It was under warranty - one year return to base, and also a supposedly '24/7 email supprt.' Yeh Right.
I am going to send them another email reoutlining the problem and including the fact that it was blatantly obvious I had bought the computer for some form of gaming use, and they had sent me a computer incapable of playing games. I will aks them to reply asap, and threaten to send the computer back If they are unhelpful. I have the advantage of having a mum who is a civil lawyer if it ever comes down to that. (and I really hope it dosen't)
What is interesting about the problem is that the computer will freeze and/or restart when I look at the screensavers, or download and veiw pictures from a digital camera in Media Centre, or try and play flight sim, but it is fine when I wantch videos online and things like that. Does anyone have any last ideas before I send the email?
My friend told me that there is a setting in system restore that, instead of restarting the computer, will show a blue screen with some technical advice and codes on, and then you can google the codes after you have manually restarted and it will tell you exactly what is wrong with your computer. Can someone tell me where to find this setting?
Thanks everyone for their help so far
Mossy.

Pro Member Chief Captain
CRJCapt Chief Captain

I don't know the setting you're referring to but give us a link to the company and computer you're dealing with so others will know to avoid them.

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer
Pro Member Captain
brownbox Captain

if you have no luck getting them to fix it, you could go exchange your video card for another one. Bigger is always better! Cool

mossy (not loggen on) Guest

Just to show you an example of how useless the company is: I just received an email from them telling me that the computer is packed and ready for shipping. I received it more than two weeks ago!
All this makes me so angry. it also suggests that the second, very angry email I sent will not be replied to for a very long time yet.

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

Ok, I cicked on the link to update my BIOS, selected open, an installing window for a few seconds, then winzip opened, I selected unzip and install, and a page came up with three things on: a text document, telling what was fixed. there seemed to be a lot of things about graphics so this could be the answer to my problem, and two icons which when I clicked on asked me to select the program to open them with. Is my BIOS updated, or is there something else I have to do?

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

Ah well I am happy and unhappy - happy because I succesfully updated my BIOS, and unhappy because it dosen't seem to have had any affect at all. I reckon I already had the latest update installed. I'm stuck then with the thing I realy don't want to do: send the computer back, wait a year and finally get it back again with a message telling me that they couldn't find anything wrong.
Thank you all very much, even though we didnt manage to fix the problem your help has still been invaluable, and I have learnt a lot about computers from it.

Pro Member Captain
ARD-DC Captain

Hi Mossy,

Sorry it hasn't worked out for you, it's a big pain to be stuck in a situation like this Sad

The blue screen with errorcodes on that you referred to earlier, I think your friend meant the "BSOD" - Blue screen of death, the screen you see when your PC crashes. This displays some technical info, a HEX dump and more stuff incomprehensible to the average human being.
Within the system restore application there aren't any options that provide you with any technical info, or at least none that I could find.

Those codes you could write down, restart your PC and then google the codes, but because your PC doesn't crash in that manner, it doesnt sound like you're helped with that tip either.

Since this thread started I have learned that .NET 3.0 has now been released as well. Download it from microsoft.com if you feel like trying..

Perhaps the best thing to do is first uninstall all ATI drivers, reboot, uninstall all .NET - items listed under the configuration panel / add/remove software section, then install .NET 3.0 and reinstall the ATI drivers.

I'll cost you a few hours again, and I wouldnt blame you if you're tired of trying by now, but you never know....

Pro Member First Officer
mossy First Officer

I have pretty much given up. I think the chances of the problem being anything non hardware related are very low, which is annoying because radeon is a good make and the chances or a broken card were very low. The people should arrive today to pick up my computer. Hopefully it will be fixed within a millenium lol.

Pro Member Captain
brownbox Captain

I would go buy a different card then. You would need to upgrade from that one anyway Cool

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