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It was all going so well.......

Pro Member First Officer
leachus2002 First Officer

Hi Again....busy day for me Crying or Very sad

After sucessfully landing my first aircraft at heathrow this morning, I am not having too much luck following on from it.

I am coming in on an ILS approach at about 160knots. The heading arrow is perfectly in the middle, but I can not get the altimiter arrow to come central, it keeps staying at the top. I am (not that I am aware on) doing anything different to earlier, but something isn't happening.

Could it be weight related? If so, how to you ditch fuel to get rid of weight, and how much?

Oh dear, questions, questions.

U lot probably think I am mad Razz

Leachus

Pro Member Captain
PanAmerican Captain

When the arrow is at the top, it usually means you are too low.

Pro Member Chief Captain
99jolegg Chief Captain

It could be a few things. Firstly, try pitching up a few degrees. If the altimeter arrow is high, it means you are too low. Pitching up will help this. When you see the arrow start to move down, lower your rate of ascent. Also, it could be that you are dropping too fast, so check your speed for your actual position, i.e. don't be at 160 KIAS too far from the runway or you will drop quickly and make sure your weight isn't too high for landing. Let us know how you get on Wink

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Pro Member First Officer
leachus2002 First Officer

Thanks for the info guys. I have tried what you have told me, but I am still having problems. For example - if I set my approach speed at 190K then I come in too fast and this happens:

But when I set my approach speed at 160k - 170k then I come in too low and crash before the runway.

This is how I have the cockpit set-up on approach (the APP was activated for an ILS landing, but for some reason it is not lit in the replay)

Any pointers would be great - it seams a shame to waste that 1 precious landing Smile

Leachus

Pro Member Chief Captain
99jolegg Chief Captain

You want your speed at around 160 - 180 KIAS depending on weight when you are about the height that you are at. Remember for that speed, you'll need at least 20 degrees of flaps, you have 5 in the bottom picture. I normally approach at around 175 KIAS which is maybe too fast, but speed can drop very quickly in that aircraft. Hope that helps Wink

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Pro Member First Officer
leachus2002 First Officer

Hi All,

Just tried an approach in a 737 - this is the result - quite sucessful actually.

Pro Member First Officer
lkw First Officer

way to go Group Wave

Pro Member First Officer
leachus2002 First Officer

I am starting to think that this is a portfolio. Hope no-one minds.

I have just tried the same approach in a VIrgin 747 and I get the same result.....

I have taken over the speed controls from 2500 and made sure that the altimiter and nav arrows stay center, but I can not avoid coming in slower than 180Kn. If I come in slower then I am too low. Obviously if I come in at 185 like in the pic, then I start to dig my own grave.

Any pointers?

I am flying in with flaps at 25 and manual speed control with autobrake set to 2.

Pro Member Chief Captain
99jolegg Chief Captain

If you can't go slower than 180 KIAS with 25 flaps to stay on the glidepath then you are probably heavy. The speed should decrease as you add the final flaps though so you land with full flaps at around 170 if you are heavy. Works for me Wink

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Pro Member Captain
PanAmerican Captain

Try using your auto-throttle set it at 180kts, then just before tuch down switch that off.

Pro Member Chief Captain
Insight Chief Captain

try lightening up the aircraft too from what the others have said, you must be landing with too much fuel

Pro Member First Officer
leachus2002 First Officer

Hi,

I am still having no luck. I am landing without any payload and with only 32,000lbs of fuel in the tank, but I still find that I have to come in at nearly 200knots for the ILS to stay center.

Is there anyway that I could set up a multi-player and get someone to run me through the basics? I must be doing something right to get the plane on the right path in the first place Laughing

Thanks
Leachus

spuddi Guest

you could use the app function within the autopilot to get you lined up with the localiseer and on the glideslope. alis

Pro Member Captain
originalgrunge Captain

Guys once again, just a reminder that just because it's heavy doesn't mean that you have to land with your speed above 160-180! If you have a moderate amount of fuel left after your flight (around 40,000 lbs), and a reasonably full payload, you should be able to land with full flaps around 140 kts and somtimes lower without stalling! Make sure you check the VRef speeds in the kneeboard (and use your Gross Weight numbers in the Fuel and Payload menu). Not being on that speed when you hit the glideslope can cause lots of glide-slope tracking issues!

Pro Member Chief Captain
99jolegg Chief Captain

originalgrunge wrote:

Guys once again, just a reminder that just because it's heavy doesn't mean that you have to land with your speed above 160-180! If you have a moderate amount of fuel left after your flight (around 40,000 lbs), and a reasonably full payload, you should be able to land with full flaps around 140 kts and somtimes lower without stalling! Make sure you check the VRef speeds in the kneeboard (and use your Gross Weight numbers in the Fuel and Payload menu). Not being on that speed when you hit the glideslope can cause lots of glide-slope tracking issues!

I've tried that so many times and have never been able to land successfully at below 150 KIAS. I can land any other aircraft at the correct speed fine, just not the 747, and I don't know why. I seem to get a smooth landing at 170 so I normally use that speed Wink

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Pro Member Chief Captain
99jolegg Chief Captain

I just attempted to land the 747 at Heathrow. I had 15% fuel in all tanks plus whatever the zero fuel weight of the aircraft is. I used Visual Flight Path to make it easier. On approach I was at 190 KIAS at which I was gliding nicely with one degree of flaps. I reduced my speed to 170 KIAS on approach and increased flaps to 20 degrees at which I was gliding nicely on the glideslope. Bought speed down to 145 KIAS at which I thought I would land with full flaps, but I dropped below the glideslope, had 8 degrees pitch up attitude to try and reach the glideslope again as I dropped below it and had -700 and increasing VSI, at which point I decided to increase speed to 160 again and ended up landing dead on at 170, very smoothly. The point being I couldn't manage to get the speed below 160 on approach Dont Know . Not too sure that there is much left to get wrong Laughing

Happy flying Wink

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Pro Member First Officer
leachus2002 First Officer

Thanks Jon,

I will give it a go now, I will post the screenshot of the result in due course Smile

Pro Member First Officer
leachus2002 First Officer

Hi Jon,

Good news, all went really well, better than expected.

Is it just me or does the flight recorder in FS2004 miss alot of parts out? Flaps, app button, reverse thrust etc?

Is there a better program out there that will record your approach and landing, or anything else you want to?

Pro Member Chief Captain
Tailhook Chief Captain

leachus2002 wrote:

Is there a better program out there that will record your approach and landing, or anything else you want to?

Have alook at this Arrow http://www.fraps.com/

Many members here use it Wink

Pro Member First Officer
beerbadger First Officer

Firstly when you are to low you DO NOT climb back to the glideslope, you return to level flight and WAIT for the glidescope to come to you, also i reccomend reducing your weight. This should help,
Regards,
Me. Very Happy

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